Talk:Algerian War

Casus belli

How can "FLN terrorism in French Algeria" be a cause for the 'Algerian War of Independence'? If anything it would a tactic within that war. Surely the cause is the French colonial rule.

photo of first press conference...

Can someone remove this photo? It has nothing to do with the Algerian war but represents nowadays Corsican independentists, FLNC meaning "front de liberation nationale de la Corse"

The starting date of this event is incorrect.

". The most notable manifestation of the new urban campaign was the Battle of Algiers, which began on September 30, 1956, when three women placed bombs at three sites including the downtown office of Air France."

Dear friends,

The events that generally constitute the Battle happened in 1957, not 1956. Although the date above for the bombings is apparently correct, (The quote seems to be from the LOC country study on Algeria.) The Battle for Algiers began On January 28, 1957 following the national strike.

Specifica dates of interest:

28 January: General strike begins in Algiers which is broken by the paras. 5 March: Larbi Ben M'hidi, FLN leader captured on 25 February, dies in custody. 21 May: Fall of the Mollet government. 29 May: An FLN commando unit massacres all the men in the village of Melouza who belong to the rival MNA. 12 September: Resignation of Paul Teitgen, secretary general for the police in Algiers, who protests at the torture methods used by the paras. 24 September: Head of the Algiers FLN, Yacef Saadi, is arrested in the Casbah.

The Battle of Algiers ends.

French Troops Clash With Algerian Civilians

This picture should be removed. It's a scene from Gillo Pontecorvo's "Battle of Algiers", not a real photo. http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A22838-2003Sep3.html

Should we change it

This war did not lead to the end of The French Empire, just led it’s decline. Leninistpython (talk) 01:57, 14 February 2024 (UTC)

The title "Algerian War"

Calling it Algerian war sounds a little biased. The war was a war of independence against a colonial power. I would suggest changing it because it sounds like a French nationalist picked this title. Previously it used to be called Algerian War of Independence on Wikipedia until someone changed it. Ahm1453 (talk) 20:38, 26 August 2024 (UTC)

Result changes

I am sure that this war resulted in a French military victory.

Previously I did not know about the "Plan Challe" or "Challe Plan", but after reading the page linked (it can be found on Simple Wikipedia) I can conclude that the resulted in a French military victory. The referendum that came after resulted in Algeria's independence. So this should be a political victory for the Algerians, but a military victory for the French, as most of the FLN leaders fled to other countries, and soldiers were liquidated after the Challe plan.

This is similar to the Greek-Bulgarian crisis of 1925. Greece, before being forced to pull out of Bulgaria, was occupying some of it. This would be defined as a Greek "success", in my opinion, as before the end of the war, they were occupying land, much like how the French soldiers, before the referendum, were occupying Algeria. So much like how Bulgaria had a diplomatic victory in said conflict, but was not winning militarily, I think that it should be the same here as well, in the sense that Algeria lost military wise but won politically, as it gained its independence.

My proposition:

Result: 1962 Evian Accords Referendum

• French military victory

• Algerian political victory Frenchman1953 (talk) 18:35, 12 February 2025 (UTC)

It resulted in the French defeat and that's that. France didn't achieve a thing and if you want, I can cite RS that say that it was defeated both militarily and diplomatically (these and other RS that describe the military outcome as "stalemate" can be seen in the article's history). In any case, the infobox reflects what the RS say about the result and I see no reason to rediscuss it ad nauseam. M.Bitton (talk) 19:22, 12 February 2025 (UTC)

> " France didn't achieve a thing"

I stated that, before the referendum, France had conducted the Challe Plan. This plan resulted in an indisputable victory for France, as it was the last operation of the war and was marked with the destruction of the FLN as a fighting force. I think that this cannot be viewed as some sort of "military defeat" or "stalemate", because as quoted in the page of the Algerian War on Wikipedia itself:

"The French Army shifted its tactics at the end of 1958 from dependence on quadrillage to the use of mobile forces deployed on massive search-and-destroy missions against FLN strongholds. In 1959, Salan's successor, General Maurice Challe, appeared to have suppressed major rebel resistance,..."

So this is nonetheless seen as a military victory for France, no matter how any government or source can put it. Hence, nothing can change the fact that France did end most of the fighting in this war with a major operational success. Frenchman1953 (talk) 20:49, 12 February 2025 (UTC)

Militarily the French won, but the Algerians acheived all their aims, so it was ultimately an Algerian victory. Given the complexity it is probably preferable to say See Aftermath Mztourist (talk) 03:08, 13 February 2025 (UTC)

There is nothing remotely complicated about the fact that the FLN won the war and no reason whatsoever to even dispute what is backed by a raft of RS and basic common sense. The same principle applies to similar articles, such as the Vietnam war (which is often compared to it). M.Bitton (talk) 03:32, 13 February 2025 (UTC)

That's a poor analogy. The North Vietnamese won the war militarily. The French won the Algerian war militarily, utterly defeating the FLN/ALN, however DeGaulle recognized that continued French control was untenable and gave the FLN all of its war aims. Mztourist (talk) 03:36, 13 February 2025 (UTC)

That's the analogy of the RS (not even needed given that the RS are unanimous in the fact that France lost the war, so badly in fact, it had to erase it from its collective memory). They aliened the very people whose hearts they were supposed to win (by putting them in concentration camps), begged for a ceasefire and accepted every FLN's demand. M.Bitton (talk) 03:39, 13 February 2025 (UTC)

it was a military stalemate, the FLN didn't beat the French and the French couldn't eradicate the FLN is what you wrote. What has changed since? M.Bitton (talk) 04:07, 13 February 2025 (UTC)

What RS is there that "France lost the war, so badly in fact, it had to erase it from its collective memory" or that France "begged for a ceasefire"? Mztourist (talk) 05:01, 13 February 2025 (UTC)

I agree. This is another good solution. But calling it an "Algerian victory" is a stretch. Frenchman1953 (talk) 05:43, 13 February 2025 (UTC)